The Acting Chairperson (Mr. McAlpine): This section of the Committee of Supply will be considering the Estimates of the Department of Culture, Heritage and Citizenship. Does the honourable minister responsible have an opening statement?

Hon. Rosemary Vodrey (Minister of Culture, Heritage and Citizenship): Yes, Mr. Chair, I do. On behalf of Manitoba Culture, Heritage and Citizenship, it is my privilege to introduce the department's 1998 Estimates for review.

Manitoba Culture, Heritage and Citizenship's mission is to promote and enhance the well-being, identity and creativity of Manitobans, while contributing to the economic viability of the province. This is our mission statement, and it reflects the Manitoba vision to continue to make Manitoba a better place to live, work and invest, by ongoing development of an environment committed to improving our high quality of life.

My department's many areas of responsibility and activity include supporting recreation opportunities, arts funding, library support services, immigration issues, identifying, evaluating and preserving heritage and historical resources, providing translation services, encouraging multiculturalism and assisting in providing communication services to all government departments.

I am very proud of the partnerships my staff have fostered in Manitoba communities and with other government departments. These partnerships maximize the use of our resources and help to provide quality services to Manitobans.

As my department begins a new fiscal year, we have defined specific priorities which will help us to contribute to the vision of Manitoba as a vibrant, vital and dynamic society built on healthy communities. The strategies we have formulated for the 1997-98 budget period centre around these key objectives: To sustain Manitoba's positive climate for arts and culture, to increase film and sound recording production, to augment the economic impact of cultural and heritage products, to promote wellness, to stimulate economic growth through increased immigration, to develop Manitoba's Internet presence on the World Wide Web, to promote public access to information and ensure privacy protection for Manitobans. Working with these objectives as the basis for our actions, Manitoba Culture, Heritage and Citizenship is committed to meeting our responsibility to assist Manitobans in building a stronger, more vibrant and economically dynamic community.

I would like to speak, first of all, about the major agencies. Since 1989 my government has invested over $25 million in restoring, maintaining and enhancing the facilities of our major cultural institutions. Provincial investment in many cases has been supplemented by contributions from the federal and municipal governments as well as private funding from donors and foundations. Recent initiatives supported through the Major Capital Program include facility repair and upgrading at the Winnipeg Art Gallery and the Manitoba Centennial Centre; facility development at the Manitoba Museum; a multiyear renovation at the Western Manitoba Centennial Auditorium; the addition of the Centre d'Patrimone at the Centre Culturel Franco-Manitoban; construction of the Italian cultural centre and the Jewish Community Campus.

We will also continue our support at community initiatives to build and enhance recreational, cultural and social infrastructure so essential to the quality of life and wellness of Manitobans. For example, Community Places Program is expected to assist 150 such projects this year. Since 1988 this program has contributed some $43 million to more than 2,200 community facility projects valued at approximately $150 million, creating jobs and economic spin-offs.

My department has maintained its level of support for operating grants to Manitoba's major cultural institutions in the 1998 budget recognizing their contributions to the province's economy and quality of life. The Winnipeg Art Gallery, the Manitoba Museum and the many organizations supported through the Manitoba Arts Council offer cultural and heritage programs that benefit Manitobans throughout the province. The Western Manitoba Centennial Auditorium and the Manitoba Centennial Centre provide modern, well-appointed spaces in which performing and community groups can offer their programs to the public. The province of Manitoba and the Manitoba Arts Council continue to enjoy a reputation throughout Canada as leaders in innovation and arts funding and for governance. The council plays a lead role in stimulating our arts and cultural sector by providing financial support to Manitoba's professional arts community through grants and scholarships. My department's continued support of the council's activities has contributed to the development of a vibrant arts community whose energy and creativity have established our province as the performing arts capital of Canada and whose hard work adds immeasurably to Manitoba's economic advancement.

In 1997-98 the Arts Branch will continue to assist the arts and cultural industry's growing contribution to our quality of life and our economic well-being. The cultural sector currently employs about 19,000 Manitobans, making an annual contribution to the province's GDP approaching $.5 billion. By initiating partnerships with the community and other government departments and agencies, the branch will provide strategic assistance to support the sector's rapid growth.

Last year at this time my predecessor the Honourable Harold Gilleshammer announced a proposed Manitoba Film and Sound Recording Development Corporation Act to establish a statutory corporation to support our film and sound industries. I am happy to announce that Bill 71, The Manitoba Film and Sound Recording Development Corporation Act, received Royal Assent on November 19, 1996. I look forward to the proclamation of the act and the appointment of the board in the very near future.

Through its support to the Manitoba Film and Sound Recording Development Corporation, my department provides just over $2 million annually towards the promotion, production, marketing, viability and growth of the film, television and sound recording industries in Manitoba. The growth of Manitoba's film industry has really been truly remarkable. An independent study commissioned last year by the Manitoba Motion Picture Industries Association indicated that between 1989 and 1994 film production in Manitoba grew 230 percent compared to 70 percent nationally. A 1995 Manitoba Bureau of Statistics report estimates that for every direct job in the film industry an additional 1.4 jobs are created and that for every dollar spent by the industry there is a $2.18 gross benefit to our economy. While total production budgets for 1996-97 total $20 million, the industry anticipates that in 1997-98 that figure may reach $45 million.

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The past year has been an eventful one for the Manitoba film production industry as the province hosted a number of high-profile projects. In June 1996 the four-hour, $8-million miniseries The Arrow, starring Dan Ackroyd, began production here. Broadcast on CBC on January 12 and 13 of this year, the miniseries received much acclaim. In August 1996 the 13-episode series The Adventures of Shirley Holmes began shooting in Winnipeg. The half-hour mystery series for seven- to 13-year-olds premiered on YTV on February 24.

Manitoba's Credo Entertainment Corporation continues to gain recognition for quality children's programming. The Alliance for Children and Television, ACT, awarded Credo's Heck's Way Home the 1996 best drama award of excellence. It won the world medal at the 39th annual New York Festival's international competition and received a Gemini nomination for best youth program or series and best writing in a children's or youth program.

To further encourage this phenomenal growth and more production opportunities, the Manitoba Film and Video Production Tax Credit was announced in the provincial budget. This tax credit will put us in a more competitive position with other Canadian provinces.

Other artistic sectors such as the recording industry, in which Manitobans are gaining recognition, are also demonstrating their potential. Five Manitoba recording artists were recently nominated for Juno Awards. The band The Watchmen, singer Chantal Kreviazuk, banjo player Danny Koulack, children's performer Jack Chenier, and classical violinist James Ehnes.

Our literary sector is proving itself to be a steady contributor to Manitoba's advancement. In Manitoba book publishing is now a $3-million industry. The Book Publishers' Support Programs administered through the Arts Branch will continue to help Manitoba book publishers to expand marketing, make company improvements and develop new product lines.

The crafts industry comprises between 3,500 and 4,500 producers across the province. These artists generate between $30 million and $38 million in total annual sales. The value of the total GDP is between $24 million and $30 million, I am informed. In the 20 years between 1971 and 1991 the number of visual artists and craftspeople in Manitoba has grown by over 150 percent. We recognize this area as one of great potential for economic development.

Acting on this information, in 1997-98 my department will launch a new program to support innovative marketing projects by Manitoba's private art galleries.

The Visual Arts and Craft Marketing Program will make it possible for galleries to participate in joint marketing initiatives and to take advantage of major arts marketing opportunities through the year of Asia-Pacific, the Canadian International Business Strategy, and the Pan American Games. Under this program, we are confident that our visual artists and craftspeople will substantially increase their role in stimulating Manitoba's artistic and economic development. A buyer's guide to arts and crafts in Manitoba, produced by my department, has received very positive response by the arts community and the public. This publication provides further impetus to the rapid growth of Manitoba's craft industry.

Mr. Chair, just for my critic's information, I have brought some of these brochures to table. I am not sure if she has had an opportunity to see them, but I am happy to table. I believe it is three copies that are required, and I have three copies, including the English and French versions.

Culture, Heritage and Citizenship is very pleased to support the development and delivery of the arts and cultural component of the 1997 Canada Summer Games in Brandon this August. This component of the games will showcase Manitoba's talents and promote the province as a tourist destination. For this reason, my department will also continue to provide consultation and administrative services to the Arts and Cultural Initiatives Committee of the Pan American Games, which are coming to Manitoba in 1999. We are providing clerical assistance to the committee and maintain an ongoing liaison with the festival's division.

We will continue to provide services in both official languages and to administer programs of financial assistance for developmental arts programming in communities throughout rural and northern Manitoba, including remote communities. Through these programs, my department will assist over 600 performances and exhibitions in rural and northern Manitoba and over three-quarters of a million hours of community-based arts instruction for Manitobans in all regions of the province. These programs provide meaningful alternatives for young people and provide valuable skills development for future vocational success.

My department continues to administer financial assistance for the international touring by the Royal Winnipeg Ballet. This fall, the RWB will represent Canada's performing arts at the European Festival of Arts in Thessaloniki, Greece. It will also be a featured guest performer during the Commonwealth Heads of State Conference in Edinburgh, Scotland. These are great honours reflecting on the RWB's international reputation and enhancing Manitoba's image as a culturally rich province.

My department will also administer the 11th annual Pre-Manitoba Awards. This year, the awards will recognize the contribution of individuals and organizations in Heritage and Recreation.

In conjunction with the Manitoba Women's Directorate, the department will co-ordinate an exhibition and provincial tour of works by Manitoba women artists from the province's exceptional collection to promote International Women's Day in October, 1997.

In Public Library Services, my department has initiated several projects to improve the accessibility and range of services offered in rural and northern public libraries. Our public library automation projects are progressing on schedule, I am informed. The Manitoba Public Library's Information Network, or MAPLIN, enables automated public libraries to connect with the Manitoba Union Catalogue and the Public Library Services circulation system. Thirty-nine of the 49 regional libraries are now using this network to access our central data base. The MAPLIN network establishes libraries as community resource centres and helps them provide access to global information networks. Sixteen public libraries in rural and northern Manitoba provide public Internet access to their communities, and more will soon follow.

My department, along with the provincial departments of Industry, Trade and Tourism, Education and Training, and Rural Development, is co-operating with Industry Canada to encourage communities to provide public access to the Internet through the Community Access project.

In the Historical Resources branch, I am pleased to note that all across Manitoba there has been a significant growth in the interest in the experiences and the opportunities afforded by our heritage. Visitors and Manitobans alike are exploring heritage sites and museums, canoeing designated heritage rivers and planning trips along highway routes having heritage themes. Recently, three highway routes have been officially identified to commemorate aspects of Manitoba's rich history: the Dawson, the La Verendrye and the Assiniboine Trails.

We are also seeing more Manitoba-based businesses, such as tea rooms, bed-and-breakfast lodgings and gift shops, make use of the many unique late 19th Century and early 20th Century homes built by Manitoba's early pioneers.

The integration of heritage resources as a viable part of community life is a fundamental mission of my department. Currently, we are working with a dedicated volunteer group in Inglis, Manitoba, to determine the possible reuse of five early grain elevators considered by experts to be the last such row of elevators left standing in Canada, and declared to be of national heritage significance.

We are also continuing our work in northern Manitoba, in co-operation with Manitoba Hydro and First Nations, to identify sites in that region associated with Manitoba's aboriginal heritage. Working closely with members of native communities, we have been able to investigate new sites in both a scientific and a culturally sensitive manner. In addition to valuable historic and archeological information, these projects have had a positive economic impact on northern communities. New educational and employment opportunities for aboriginal people have emerged from these activities as well as a greater public awareness of aboriginal contributions, culture and history.

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Partnerships with Manitoba communities and businesses to safeguard our heritage for future generations are leading to new audiences and opportunities. My department, in co-operation with Manitoba Rural Development, is sponsoring a workshop on community-driven heritage tourism as part of the Brandon Rural Forum to be held now in June, in response to the ground swell of interest expressed by community groups in developing local heritage sites.

In 1991, the Historic Resources branch of my department proposed to produce a series of brochures highlighting heritage sites in each of the six rural regions of the province, to promote heritage as a part of tourism and economic development. The proposal was seen as complementary to the Explore Manitoba promotional material then being prepared by Industry, Trade and Tourism. Our colleagues in Industry, Trade and Tourism agreed to cost-share this initiative with us. My department selects information for the brochures, oversees both design and publication preparation, and our Tourism colleagues assist in the production and distribution of the 45,000 brochures printed each year. Titles to date include: The Heritage of Westman, 1992; The Heritage of the Central Plains, 1993; The Heritage of the Interlake, 1995; and our new brochure for this year, The Heritage of the Parkland, 1996.

Mr. Chair, I also have some copies of this brochure for my colleague. She may have seen it, but in case she has not, she might like to have it for her own records.

Underway in 1997-98 is work on the Norman Region. Eastman will be completed in 1998-99.

The heritage tourism regional brochures are distributed in Manitoba through the seven Travel Manitoba Information Centres and through Travel Manitoba bulk mailings to Chambers of Commerce and local information booths. The Historic Resources branch also distributes the brochures to Culture, Heritage and Citizenship regional offices, museums, schools and libraries in regular mailings and to the community participants in the project.

I am pleased services and programs offered in the heritage field by my department are based on working co-operatively with community volunteers, businesses and other provincial departments. Together, we are supporting increased interest, commitment and ingenuity shown by the public in celebrating Manitoba's rich heritage.

Recreation and Wellness Promotion Branch. The establishment of the Recreation and Wellness Promotion Branch has positioned my department to develop preventative strategies designed to enhance individual and community wellness. The work of the branch centres on the key principle of empowering individuals to take a greater responsibility for sustaining their own health and well-being, thus contributing to our overall goal of healthier communities.

A key component of the branch strategy is the development of a planning document titled Physical Inactivity-A Framework for Action. This will lead to the implementation of Manitoba's physical activity strategy.

Another area of concern to me and to my department is youth at risk. A national research study has focused attention on the positive role that recreation and physical activity can play in the development of young people and in the reduction of risk factors. To better co-ordinate the delivery of service, the branch has developed an action plan titled Manitoba Framework on Youth-at-Risk: Strategies for Collaboration.

The Provincial Coordinating Committee on Recreational Water Safety represents 22 community and government agencies. This committee was established in June 1996 in response to recommendations advanced by the Chief Medical Examiner. The committee is developing a resource manual of guidelines for waterfront safety to be distributed in draft form to identified waterfront operators this spring. A final copy will be released in time for the 1998 waterfront season.

The Regional Services branch of my department supports rural, remote and northern communities in stimulating positive change and encouraging sustainable growth and improved quality of life and wellness. Regional staff provide delivery for programs of 26 agencies and branches from 10 provincial government departments.

The Information Resources division of my department co-ordinates and manages government advertising, communications and the delivery of public information services. Through this division my department is helping establish Manitoba's presence on the Internet and realizing its tremendous potential in providing access to government information services and programs. To date, 16 departments are on the Internet and the remaining department will be on line this year.

The Provincial Services Division of my department oversees a variety of activities for both public and government clients, including the delivery of English and French translation services, management of the Provincial Archives, responsibility for the Manitoba Legislative Library and the handling of government records.

When Manitoba introduced its first Freedom of Information legislation a few years ago, responsibility for administering the act was placed with the Provincial Services Division. A new act will be introduced this session. Public consultations have provided important guidance for this new legislation, which will balance protection of personal privacy and the right to access information.

I am pleased to report that Manitoba's endeavours to access and utilize emerging technologies are proceeding very well. We have, for example, recently collaborated with the Hudson's Bay History Foundation to launch a new 300-page Internet website, highlighting the priceless Hudson's Bay Company Archives collection.

The Citizenship division of Culture, Heritage and Citizenship played a lead role in the completion of negotiations for the Canada-Manitoba immigration agreement signed on October 22, 1996. Through this agreement, Manitoba has now gained a solid commitment from the federal government to assist the province in meeting its immigration objectives and playing a role in national immigration policies.

The effective implementation of the agreement will boost our ability to bring new businesses and industries to Manitoba to address unique industry employment requirements and to stimulate the expansion of existing Manitoba-based businesses. This agreement will also support Manitoba's commitment to family reunification and our ongoing commitment to humanitarian initiatives designed to assist refugees.

One of our most successful undertakings this past year has been the completion of the sewing machine operator program. In this initiative we completed negotiations on the terms and conditions to recruit 157 sewing machine operators for the rapidly growing Manitoba fashion industry.

Another initiative is our promotion and recruitment campaign, focusing on highly skilled, independent immigrants. The promotion strategy includes targeted print advertising, Internet advertising, Internet communication and conducting information seminars with Canada's diplomatic posts abroad.

The Citizenship Division has also partnered with Industry, Trade and Tourism to develop a new initiative this year on information seminars abroad. This joint approach was adopted to reduce cost and also to maximize Manitoba's exposure to potential immigrants, whether business immigrants or independent immigrants.

To date this year, information seminars have been conducted in the Philippines, Kiev, Argentina, London, Scotland, and Ireland with encouraging results. Our goal is to increase Manitoba's share of immigration from 1.7 percent or--and these are the numbers, I am informed--3,541 arrivals in 1995 to Manitoba's proportional share, which is 3.5 percent or approximately 8,000 arrivals, I am informed, based on the 1996 national immigration plan.

The good news is that preliminary 1996 figures are already showing a significant increase in our immigration numbers with an increase from 1.7 percent in 1995 to 2 percent of overall immigration in 1996.

I am pleased to report that our activities have definitely stimulated interest in Manitoba. Last year we reported that Citizenship Division's Manitoba home page on the Internet had approximately 53,000 website documents access. This year I am proud to tell you that this number has doubled in the past year, representing well over 100,000 inquiries through this high-tech portal.

I am also pleased to inform you that from 1994, the inception of the promotion and recruitment campaign, to 1996, the skilled independent category of immigration has increased, I am informed, 100 percent. Manitoba had 563 arrivals in 1994, and in 1996 we welcomed 1,130 new arrivals to our community.

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The Citizenship Division has pursued many other initiatives to enhance its ability to respond to the needs of newcomers. It has, for example, completed the Innovative Pathways Project. This is an interactive computer model pilot program which provides information on Manitoba's accreditation processes with respect to six professions and 29 trades. The division has developed information fact sheets in conjunction with the Department of Education and Training that outline the accreditation processes in 40 trades. Accreditation processes with professional associations have been documented and fact sheets have been developed for 31 professions.

In partnership with nine school divisions, numerous employers and community college and community organizations, the division offers a complete adult English as a Second Language system. In the last year, I am informed 2,450 students obtained ESL training through this system.

A variety of violence prevention initiatives, such as Family Harmony Conference, has been underway in conjunction with community groups, agencies and the federal government. In this conference a series of workshops for teachers, ethnocultural service workers and youth peer counsellors were offered on preventing interpersonal violence among youth. These workshops coincided with training for the introduction of a healthy relationships curriculum, which is being piloted in two Manitoba school divisions over the next three years. It is intended to assist young people, Grades 7, 8 and 9, to develop their communication skills and to critically assess information they receive, particularly from the media, about violence, sex roles, power, control and sexuality, in order to make healthy and positive choices for their relationships.

On the Multiculturalism Secretariat recent restructuring of my department has seen the assistant deputy minister of the Citizenship Division assume responsibility for the Multiculturalism Secretariat and its activities. As part of the Citizenship Division, the Multiculturalism Secretariat is a central source of assistance to citizens from ethnocultural communities in their efforts to access government departments and services. The secretariat in turn will benefit from a broader access to technological and human resources. My department considers the secretariat with its programs, initiatives and services, and its strong links to the ethnocultural community, an invaluable resource to Manitoba's immigration and recruitment plans.

At Manitoba Culture, Heritage and Citizenship, we are very proud of the work that we do and the contributions that we make to the advancement of Manitoba. Our programs, initiatives, activities and partnerships touch the economic, social, personal and environmental aspects of the lives of our citizens directly and indirectly virtually every day. Manitobans place a great importance on their communities and the opportunities which are available. The key objectives we have identified and built our strategies around will enable my department to promote and enhance the well-being, identity and creativity of Manitobans while contributing to the economic viability of the province. I am confident that through the Estimates I have placed before you, Manitoba Culture, Heritage and Citizenship will be able to meet the expectations of Manitobans in positive and realistic ways. I am also confident that this budget will allow us to maintain and strengthen Manitoba's communities now and into the 21st Century. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

The Acting Chairperson (Mr. McAlpine): I thank the honourable minister for those comments. Does the critic for the official opposition have opening comments?

Ms. Diane McGifford (Osborne): Yes, Mr. Chairman, I do. Thank you very much. Certainly in her opening statements the minister has made clear the pleasures of this ministry. I told the former minister last year that I considered myself very lucky to be involved in Culture and Heritage, and I continue to have that good fortune. I am pleased to share it with the current minister, and I thank her for her statement. I am very glad that the two of us happen to be off the sandbagging line at the same time, so we have the opportunity to meet today.

I wanted to take the opportunity to once again congratulate the various cultural groups and heritage groups which have opened their doors to persons who have been victimized by the flood. I am sure the minister joins me here. I also wanted to take this opportunity to formally thank Joanne DiCosimo who is soon going to be leaving the Manitoba Museum, congratulate her on her new appointment and thank her for the work she has done in Manitoba amongst which has been the change of name from the Museum of Man and Nature to the Manitoba Museum, which, as I indicated last year to the former minister, I thought was quite an advance.

I wanted to outline for the minister the areas in which I was going to be asking questions. I thought that might be helpful as far as arranging staff. I wanted to begin today by asking some questions about some of the acts for which the minister is responsible. Then I want to ask a few questions about the Film Classification Board. I have quite a few questions about Culture, Heritage and Recreation, about that division; some questions about information resources. Then if it is possible and if the minister agrees, I would like to move on and ask some questions about capital appropriations, and then my colleague from Point Douglas (Mr. Hickes) will ask questions on citizenship and multiculturalism. So I put that out, and maybe the minister can respond to it later.

In preparing for these Estimates, I looked back through former Estimates books and, of course, through former annual reports. I found that in 1990-91 the actual expenditure in the Department of Culture, Heritage and Citizenship was $59,614,200 and in 1995, the actual expenditure was $52,308,500. Of course, the actual expenditure for 1996-97 is not yet available. For 1997-98, the estimated expenditure is $51,528,300. So what I notice here, then, is more than an $8 million or 13 percent reduction to Culture, Heritage and Citizenship, which concerns me. I do not think that this bodes well for our province or suggests necessarily that we do have a strong commitment or that this government does have a strong commitment to arts and culture, because I think if we include inflation in this figure, it could be almost double the $8 million or the 13 percent. I do notice that the only steadily increasing line in Culture, Heritage and Citizenship is the minister's salary, and I say this with no disrespect to the minister. I realize the minister does not have control over that, but this still is a fact that the Minister's Salary in 1990-91 was $20,600 and today it is $25,700. So it does not surprise me, Mr. Chair, when I hear from the community that they remember the golden days when Eugene Kostyra or Judy Wasylycia-Leis were the ministers.

Now, I know that one of the things that this government is very fond of is corporate partnerships and encouraging corporate partnerships. It certainly seems to me to be a very good idea. I would support that; my side of the House would support that. Of course, it is not always a possibility. One example that leaps to mind is the recent Manitoba Theatre Centre production of The Glace Bay Miner's Museum. Apparently it was impossible to find a corporate sponsor for this play. I think it is probably because this play was pro-labour and pro-union, so there was no corporate sponsorship available.

Corporate sponsorship is a possibility, but in other cases it is not a possibility and for a host of reasons. It is more possible for some art forms than it is for others. For example, I think it is probably much more easy, and I think the minister would agree with me, for the opera to find a corporate sponsorship than it is for a small arts magazine.

I think that the minister and I both agree that government has a responsibility to the culture and heritage of our province, though we probably have some different ideas on exactly what these responsibilities are, to whom we are responsible and how we should fulfill these responsibilities. Certainly in her opening remarks, the minister's opening remarks, reflect the decisions of her government, the policies reflect her ideas and her goals. Mine and the ideas of my caucus I think will emerge through the comments and questions I make as we go through the Estimates process.

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I wanted to make a few comments on the minister's opening remarks. I was very glad that the minister stressed the importance of art in the economic development of our province, and stressed the economic spin-offs of the arts. Certainly, the growth in film production at 230 percent is quite remarkable. I think we need to congratulate that sector. The minister also recognized the importance of the arts in job creation, and I quite concur with her. She mentioned several of the film productions that had taken place in Manitoba. She mentioned The Arrow and she mentioned Dan Ackroyd. I certainly enjoyed watching The Arrow and sharing some time with Dan Ackroyd on July 1 in Osborne Village where he was our guest speaker, a very able and very exciting speaker for everybody present I might add.

The minister also commented on the production of Shirley Holmes. I am sure both the minister and I, since the minister as well as being the minister for Culture, Heritage and Citizenship is also the Minister for the Status of Women (Mrs. Vodrey), and I am also the critic for the Status of Women, we are very pleased with this series, because here we had a young woman in a central role. I think the minister and I both agree that we need more of this kind of modelling for young women in the province of Manitoba and indeed in Canada. So I was very happy with that series, and the minister obviously was too, because she is nodding assent.

The minister I think was very right in saluting our musicians and our publishers, acknowledging the craft industry and the role it plays in Manitoba. She also mentioned visual artists and I share her appreciation for all of these people. I look forward to the launch of the arts marketing program that the minister has cited. I believe it would include visual and crafts people. I look forward to reading the minister's remarks when they appear in Hansard. Hearing them I did not quite get everything, so I apologize if I am not quite accurate. I certainly look forward to that. I thank her for the Art & Crafts Buyer's Guide and I do have a copy, but I do not know if this is the same one I have or whether it is updated. I will have to check when I am back at my office.

I join the minister in saluting the RWB. It is just an absolutely wonderful company. We are very, very fortunate to have the Royal Winnipeg Ballet with us and we wish them the best of luck in the tours that the minister mentioned.

The minister also mentioned something that I find very exciting, and that was a tour of women visual artists, I understand she said in recognition of IWD in October, International Women's Day, but I think International Women's Day is on March 8. So I wonder if it was Persons' Day, just to put that out.

I am very pleased to hear of the evolving interest and increased interest in heritage and historic properties. The minister mentioned the growing numbers of tea rooms and bed and breakfasts. As I am sure you all will agree, NDPers are always interested in economic development, and we are especially supportive of small business and this kind of local enterprise. I think this is certainly going to make Manitoba more attractive to tourists. These are very wonderful places to stay, to be with the family, so I think, the more, the better.

Also, working in the North with aboriginal people, the minister cited employment opportunities, which of course is only to be encouraged. I also am very pleased that the projects that the minister cited are projects that are very aware of the cultural sensitivities, and that will be very much a part of what takes place there.

Thank you for the Heritage brochure. I have not seen the others. I appreciate the one in the Parkland, and I certainly look forward to perhaps seeing the rest of them. With those few remarks, Mr. Chair, I think I will close. Just to tell the minister, once again, I do look forward to reading her remarks in more detail once I get my copy of Hansard.

The Acting Chairperson (Mr. McAlpine): We thank the critic for the official opposition for those remarks. I would remind members of the committee that debate on the Minister's Salary, item 1.(a), is deferred until all other items in the Estimates of this department are passed. At this time, I would invite the minister's staff to take their places in the Chamber.

Ms. McGifford: I wanted to ask the minister, if the minister agrees, about a couple of the acts for which she is responsible. I do not know what the protocol or procedure is, whether I can do it now, whether staff should be here, there or--I wonder if you could clarify it for me.

The Acting Chairperson (Mr. McAlpine): The staff will please take their places in the Chamber. The honourable member for Osborne, one second, please. I had asked the honourable minister to please introduce the staff present in the Chamber today.

Mrs. Vodrey: Mr. Chair, first of all I would like to introduce Mr. Dave Paton. He is the acting deputy minister at the moment and he is the Executive Director of Administration and Finance at all other times. This is the ADM of the Programs Division. This is Lou-Anne Buhr. The others are not coming at the moment. So that is who we have here at the moment.

The Acting Chairperson (Mr. McAlpine): I would invite the honourable member for Osborne to pose her remarks or her comment now.

Ms. McGifford: Yes, Mr. Chair, I wanted to ask the minister about one or two acts for which she is responsible and I wanted to know whether this is an appropriate time.

Mrs. Vodrey: I think the best way to proceed is to have the member ask the questions. If I am able to provide the answer this time, I will. If not, I will take it as notice or ask that it be deferred to the line in which the appropriate staff might be here.

Ms. McGifford: I have an Order-in-Council 166. I notice that on this Order-in-Council it does not include The Liquor Control Act for which I understand the minister is responsible. I wonder if there is something here that I do not understand. I wonder if the minister could explain the situation. This list begins with Statutes Responsibility Minister of Culture, Heritage and Citizenship, but that particular act is not here, so that is my question.

(Mr. Jack Penner, Acting Chairperson, in the Chair)

Mrs. Vodrey: As I do not have a copy of the Order-in-Council, I would have to look into that. Certainly what is listed in our Estimates book is the responsibility of the Minister of Culture. The Minister responsible for the Liquor Commission is in addition and unrelated to my specific responsibilities as Minister of Culture; it is a separate one. As is the Minister for the Status of Women, it is in addition to this particular responsibility.

Ms. McGifford: Is it appropriate at this time then to ask the minister some questions about the enforcement of The Liquor Control Act?

Mrs. Vodrey: The issues relating to The Liquor Control Act are dealt with before committee, before the Public Utilities committee. I believe that is being scheduled or rescheduled for May 22.

Ms. McGifford: May I ask some questions then about The Freedom of Information Act?

The Acting Chairperson (Mr. Penner): Yes, you may.

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Ms. McGifford: The minister spoke in her opening remarks about the replacement of this act with what I believe she described as an access to information and privacy protection act. I wonder if the minister could outline the process for collecting public input into this proposed act.

Mrs. Vodrey: I would like to welcome to the table Sue Bishop, who is the executive director of Provincial Services.

I am very happy to talk a little bit about the process. First of all, I understand that there was prepared a public discussion paper. With that public discussion paper that was circulated, there was, I understand, quite a good response back to that. We felt that many of the responses were, in fact, very thoughtful and very constructive. I understand that, in response to that discussion paper, meetings were held with individuals, with organizations, and with businesses during October 1996. Submissions were received from outside of government and also from within government. Government departments and agencies were asked to provide advice on this initiative as it would relate to their services, their clients, and their stakeholders.

Ms. McGifford: I wonder if the minister could tell me if there were any public meetings, public meetings meaning open to the public where the public came and made presentation to a committee of people.

Mrs. Vodrey: I understand, Mr. Chair, I am informed that meetings were scheduled on request. Those requests may have been at the request of individuals or groups who wanted to make comment. To my knowledge, those people who wanted to be heard on the issue certainly were heard on the issue.

Ms. McGifford: Could the minister tell me please how many meetings there were and where they were?

Mrs. Vodrey: I am informed that there were approximately 25 oral meetings in which people came and provided information verbally, based on their comments.

Ms. McGifford: I am sure the minister agrees that a freedom of information act, by its very title, would suggest that the more public input we have into that the better. With that in mind, I wonder if the minister could tell me something about the numbers of persons who attended the public meetings.

Mrs. Vodrey: I will have to get further information on the people who attended the meetings. I do not want the member to be mixed up in terms of the fact that the public will still have a very full opportunity in which to look at this information, which deals both with freedom of information and protection of privacy. It deals with both, while the old Freedom of Information Act dealt only with one part.

So when the legislation is introduced into the House, and when we go to committee, then we will have another opportunity for the public to comment fully. So there was some opportunity for the public to comment on concepts and issues which they had, based on the discussion paper. Then when decisions have been made and when the legislation is prepared, there will be another opportunity during the committee hearing process for the public to comment.

Ms. McGifford: I am very well aware that it is an access to information and privacy protection bill. I think it is high time that we had one and caught up with the other jurisdictions in our country. So I am very pleased about the fact that this bill will be tabled. I look forward to reading the bill. I do think that producing a sound bill ahead of time and not depending on people to come to committee and make presentations to straighten it out makes good sense. I am concerned that the public be well represented ahead of time, ahead of the bills being drafted, ahead of the bills being tabled in the legislature, and also that the public come out at the committee level and provide more information. I do know that it is a bill that covers both areas.

Now, earlier the minister mentioned, and I do know that the former minister last year circulated a document inviting discussion papers on the proposed legislation. I would like to know to whom that document was circulated, how was it decided who got one and who did not, how many went out and perhaps the number of responses. The minister might have told me that. If so, I am sorry I did not jot it down.

Mrs. Vodrey: Mr. Chair, I am informed that there were approximately 2,000 copies of the paper distributed. The paper was made available in both English and French in printed form and also on the Internet, and because it was so widely available in all of those mediums, it was certainly available for people to access it. In terms of a list or anything more detailed in terms of who actually received any of the 2,000 copies, I will have to follow up with the member. Certainly there was an effort, as I can see, to reach a broad number of people to gain responses and also by placing it on the Internet to make sure that people who wish to access their information in a number of forums would be able to do so.

Ms. McGifford: I do not need to have a list to whom the discussion paper was sent. I am interested in knowing what the criteria were in determining who received the document.

Mrs. Vodrey: Well, I am informed, if this is helpful, some of the 2,000 groups included rights groups, included consumers association, education and municipal stakeholders. I have a list of some: Manitoba Association for Rights and Liberties, Consumers' Association of Manitoba, Canadian Association of Journalists, Legal Data Resources Corporation, the Manitoba Teachers' Society. So that is an example of some of the groups who received the discussion paper.

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Ms. McGifford: I believe, in fact I know last year in Estimates, the former minister told me that once the submissions to the discussion paper were received, they would be gathered together and there would be a compilation of papers and responses to the original discussion document. I believe he said it would be called, "What you have told Us," and I understand that he also said the "What you have told Us" document would then be sent out and responses received to that. I wonder if this process was followed.

Mrs. Vodrey: I can just say that I was not present in Estimates, obviously, in this role last year, but I understand that there was not a commitment made to individuals or groups when they made their submissions that there would be a follow-up document other than the fact that those who made oral presentations, I understand, would have an opportunity to review notes regarding their presentation before they were filed. Notes or documents for all submissions would be available for public review, and all submissions have been made available to the public through the Provincial Archives and the Legislative Library.

Ms. McGifford: No, the minister made a commitment, at least I thought it was a commitment, in Estimates, that the documents that were submitted would be gathered together and sent out to those who submit it, and I wondered if that step had been taken. I know that the documents are available in the Provincial Archives because I have looked at them.

Mrs. Vodrey: I suppose the difficulty is always trying to make sure that we in Manitoba have the protection that we believe and the public believes is important to them in a timely way.

I am sorry, the commitment made in Estimates, I am not sure--I understand that was not made to the presenter, is my understanding. Our commitment is that we want to have this legislation tabled this session. So we have proceeded, having had public input at the front end, having had available the submissions that were given if people want to check and find out what you have told us is available. It is not as if it is not available. It is available, and it is available to the public. It has not been compiled by my department or specifically by this government, but it is available.

For us now, our goal is based on the thinking of a lot of submissions which were given and decisions ultimately which this government has to make based on legislation. We have moved ahead. We will be moving ahead in the interests of Manitobans because, not only do we need the freedom of information side, the member knows this, but many other people perhaps realize only that there is a freedom of information and there is not the protection of privacy. Our commitment is to move ahead with the legislation. I will be tabling that legislation this session.

Ms. McGifford: It seems to me the minister is telling me that ministers are not bound by remarks that they make on the record in Estimates. That seems to me somewhat strange, if I might say. I do know, Mr. Chair, that the documents are available for persons to go down and peruse them. I believe they are in the Legislative Library as well as being in the Archives. I think that a group who made a submission would be more likely to respond to a set of documents sent to them than have to come down here and go through documents and make response that way.

It does seem to me, to get back to the point that I began with, a commitment on Hansard is a commitment to Manitobans, and the government, the minister should stand by it.

Mrs. Vodrey: I certainly believe that commitments do need to be followed up on. The method, it seems to me, that this commitment has been followed up on is to make available to the public all of those submissions, to make available to the public the information which was provided. The member began her line of questioning in terms of the public's participation, the public's ability to make comment. I understand that they did make comment, and those comments are publicly available. There has been certainly no effort not to have that information available. I understand that if there has been a specific request, copies have been sent out on request, but the availability is there. The member may not feel that that has met the minister's commitment. The minister's commitment would have been what you have told us, the availability of that material.

Sometimes we are told, if we produce the document, that we have censored the information. I have heard that in Estimates already this year, and so what is available is not any kind of document that the members may want to suggest we have somehow put together ourselves. What is available is in fact my understanding is what people have said. That is I think important and certainly a way to meet the commitment. The next part of the commitment, Mr. Chair, is to table the legislation. So that is what will happen now.

The member, I am not sure if she wants to put another staff in this. I believe it may have the effect of delaying. I think that what is available has accomplished the effort. I see the member for Wolseley (Ms. Friesen) shaking her head and, yet, the member for Osborne (Ms. McGifford) and I appear to be having a fairly equitable discussion on issues. We may not agree totally, but I believe we were at least answering and asking questions fairly.

Ms. McGifford: I think that the minister and I probably will have to agree to disagree on this particular issue. I do stand by the point that the minister made a commitment to gather responses together and to send them out to those who had originally made submission. I think it is regrettable that the process is not being honoured. I do not mean to claim, Mr. Chair--I certainly do not mean to claim that there is not the opportunity for public input. It is a question of process, but, as I say, perhaps we should move on.

I wanted to ask a question that really grows out of the 1995 Ombudsman's report, and if I might quote from that report. The report says that the Premier (Mr. Filmon) in a memo to the deputy minister advised that Culture, Heritage and Citizenship had been requested to propose measures to enhance and co-ordinate the level of service and quality of training. I wonder if I could have some details about both, about service enhancement and training.

Mrs. Vodrey: I am informed that there were two initiatives addressing this issue. In June 1996, there was an informal meeting with all the FOI co-ordinators, and I am also informed that in October '96 there were informational meetings on fair information practices held.

Ms. McGifford: I wonder if the minister could give some details about these meetings and how they acted to enhance service and improve training.

Mrs. Vodrey: Although Sue Bishop is here, the information that the member is seeking is, in detail, not here at the moment. So what I would ask is that, on line 14.3 (d), if the member would like to re-ask the question then, we will make every effort to have that information available at that time.

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The Acting Chairperson (Mr. Penner): Before we continue with the questioning that is going on, I think we probably were remiss in making a statement that we normally make. I think what I need to do then, as Chair, is bring the issue of the Estimates process, in other words, the financial statements, into proper discussion. If you would allow me to do that, I would do that now.

I would just like to remind members of the committee that the debate on Minister's Salary, which is item 1.(a), is deferred until all other items of the Estimates of this department are passed. At this time, I would invite the minister's staff to take their place. I do not think--[interjection] That was said? Okay. I am reminded that that was said.

I would then ask that 14.1 Administration and Finance (b) Executive Support (1) Salaries and Employee Benefits be considered at this time.

Ms. McGifford: I see that we have an acting deputy minister with us today. I wonder if the minister could tell us if the former deputy minister is no longer with Culture, Heritage and Citizenship.

Mrs. Vodrey: The deputy minister is away on sick leave at the moment. She is not expected to join us during the course of Estimates.

The Acting Chairperson (Mr. Penner): Item 14.1. (b) Executive Support (1) Salaries and Employee Benefits $423,800--pass; (2) Other Expenditures $74,200--pass.

14.1.(c) Financial and Administrative Services (1) Salaries and Employee Benefits $1,908,600--pass; (2) Other Expenditures $266,000--pass.

14.1.(d) Manitoba Film Classification Board.

Ms. McGifford: I think I indicated earlier that I wanted to ask some questions about the Film Classification Board. I wonder, I would ask some straightforward questions. Initially, I wonder if the minister could tell me the number of board members in the Film Classification Board and tell me something about the reviewing process for making decisions about the classification of film.

Mrs. Vodrey: There are presently 22 members on the Film Classification Board. The process is that they sit for feature films in panels of three, and for videos in panels of two. They then reach a consensus report on the classification.

Ms. McGifford: Could the minister tell me, I notice that there are three staff members, are these three persons--no, they are not inspectors. Are inspectors included in these three staffpersons?

Mrs. Vodrey: Yes, Mr. Chair.

Ms. McGifford: Could the minister tell me which persons, the professional, technical, or administrative support, are the inspectors?

Mrs. Vodrey: There are two individuals who do the inspections. I understand that there were focuses on complaints.

Ms. McGifford: Sorry, I did not get the last bit from the minister because of the door.

Mrs. Vodrey: A great deal of the work of the inspectors focuses on complaints which are given.

(Mr. Gerry McAlpine, Acting Chairperson, in the Chair)

Ms. McGifford: The minister said that the inspections then are complaint driven, which of course makes sense because we see in the Estimates book that there are 850 video retail licensed facilities and 50 video distributors. I do not know how many theatres there are in Manitoba, but it would obviously be impossible for two inspectors to do all this inspection on a regular basis. Of course, we have to consider here the complexities of geography in Manitoba. There are people in the North, the east, the west, theatres there and video outlets there. So I appreciate regular inspection would be extremely difficult and appreciate that it is complaint driven.

I wonder if the minister could tell me how frequent complaints from the public are, and I mean, especially, of course, complaints regarding the classification of films and videos.

Mrs. Vodrey: I just want to clarify that, although I understand the inspectors act on complaints in terms of their numbers, they also do inspections that are not necessarily complaint driven, although I understand that a large proportion is in fact responding to issues which are presented to the Film Classification Board. I am informed that we do not have today the number of complaints, but we will get that for the member.

Ms. McGifford: I find it interesting that the minister has said that, although the process is basically--or I may be misquoting her--but generally complaint driven. There are also regular inspections. I wonder if the minister could tell me how inspections are done throughout the province. Is there a regular junket on which an inspector goes up to Churchill and works his or her way down, or what is the process here?

Mrs. Vodrey: I am informed that the inspection occurs as a priority on adult video stores and that there is a regular rotation of inspection of the adult video stores. Also, that tends to be the focus of complaints as well.

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Ms. McGifford: I have always found adult video stores to be a contradiction in terms, but I do not necessarily expect the minister to do anything about that. Adult video stores are then the 18-plus, the category would be the 18-plus category?

Mrs. Vodrey: Yes, I am informed. Yes, that is right.

Ms. McGifford: I understand that The Amusements Act was either passed or at least last revisited in 1987. Last year the then minister said in Estimates that, since 1996 was the 10th anniversary of The Heritage Resources Act, he thought it was a good time to review the act. So I want to ask this minister since this is the 10th anniversary of The Amusements Act, I wonder if this minister has any plans to review this act and especially to review not the work of film classification, but the classification categories themselves.

Mrs. Vodrey: At the moment there are not plans to review The Amusements Act. At the moment that has not been one of the issues that had been put forward. I understand at the moment that there have not been complaints about the current act, identifying specific issues. However, I am told that we are certainly willing to work with other provinces in an effort to try and standardize or make similar classification among provinces so that it will have the same meaning in each province. I understand at the moment that is one of the efforts of the people involved in the Film Classification Board, our chair in particular.

Ms. McGifford: I wanted to tell the minister that any connection or any communication I have had with the people from the Film Classification Board has been very helpful. I find the people very helpful. I am sure that everybody is doing his or her job as it is defined in the act. I am very impressed with these people. I wonder if the minister herself is content with the system, with the categories, and whether she believes that our current system is working in the best interests of all Manitobans.

Mrs. Vodrey: I think it is probably best just to be quite straightforward in my answer to say that I am just really coming to know in detail the work of the Film Classification Board and their issues, having them bring to me some of the issues that they see and also having people begin to talk to me about those issues.

I have not yet had a lot of exposure or comments made in that area. That does not mean to say that I would close the door on any of those issues. I hope over the next while to be able to develop more fully a very good comprehension of the issues that people are bringing. At this point my understanding is there has not been a series of complaints. There has been an effort to work with other provinces, and there is some effort on the part of the Film Classification Board to identify what may be issues. In terms of anything further at this point, I think I am just going to have to wait, and the member and I can speak about this at another time as well, if she would like to.

Ms. McGifford: I wonder if I could just pursue the matter a little bit, however. I understand that the Film Classification Board merely classifies films and it does not make judgments on films. I appreciate that, and I appreciate the complexities of making judgments as to what is obscene, what is not obscene, and that kind of thing.

I note in the video update from the Film Classification Board, the one that goes to the retailer, I note the note that reads, as some titles classified as 18-plus may be considered offensive, please place the 18-plus video updates in a separate catalogue not available to individuals under the age of 18.

I can appreciate that retailers are frequently called upon to make judgments on age, whether that be with selling cigarettes, renting in this case certain kinds of videos, or indeed in purchasing alcohol. What I wanted to ask the minister, does this mean then that a video that the law might determine to be obscene may, indeed, be in an outlet and would be there until a member of the public raised a complaint with the police who would then perhaps seize that video and make a determination.

Mrs. Vodrey: I know that the member knows that the Film Classification Board's role is only classification. They are not able to censor, and the identification of a material as obscene comes through the federal Criminal Code. There has to be, in fact, a way in which to determine that it violates a community standard and so on. There are a number of issues that relate to that. So it is very difficult for me in a hypothetical scenario to actually make a statement on what she has put forward. I believe that the Classification Board is diligent. I believe that when our government put in place, at least the 18-plus, that was another step in terms of trying to make sure that material, which may not have been classified as obscene, but which is clearly adult, is not available easily and openly to particularly young people.

I know too that there has been consideration of these issues in terms of our correctional institutions and so on in making an effort that there not be something which may incite violent behaviour or whatever available easily. That can be made, not by the Film Classification Board, but by the institution itself. I am informed that the mandate is to provide information to parents as to the content and to guide a viewing choice. That is the focus of the Film Classification Board.

The Acting Chairperson (Mr. McAlpine): The hour being 6 p.m., committee rise. Call in the Speaker.

The Acting Speaker (Mr. McAlpine): The hour being after 6 p.m., this House is adjourned and stands adjourned until 1:30 p.m. tomorrow (Wednesday).